High gain amp.

[barman]

Hey guys,I am looking to buy a new high gain amp. In your opinion which is the best? Soldano, Bogner Uberschall, Mesa Rectifier (single,daul or tripple), other?


Thanks!

[wsaraceni]

i think they are all real different. i own a dual rectifier and while i love it for rhythm, i hate it for lead work. it has a lot of useful tones in it.

[Phil Macino]

I agree with Bill.

When you get into the range of amps that you are listing in your poll, the player is choosing them for a very specific reason and or sound quality. Soldanos tend to focus on the upper mids, whereas the Uberschall, like the Rectifier, would focus on the lower mid frequencies. IMO, speaker cabinets, also play a huge roll in the overall sound and complete the package.

In the "high gain" area I have owned a Dual Rec (3 Channel), a Rivera KnuckleHead II, and A Bogner Uberschall. Of the 3, still have the Uberschall and use it twice a week. The Rivera (which I used for about 6 months with the same frequency as my Bogner) had the most bell like clean channel, and the Uberschall's clean, to draw and anology, would be more like a Marimba, ...very "woody" and organic sounding. Also, the Rivera I felt had many more "finesse" oriented tweaks and this amp found a home with our own Mightypudge, who has been gigging it and has gotten some *great* tone with it based on some gig reports.

Sonically I'd say that the Uberschall tends to not sound as compressed as the Rivera, and not have the "buzz" of the Recto....the power section seems to come through more. Personally, I have found that medium output pickups tend to sound really good with it. ie: McCarty and Singlecuts...my Custom 24 was just a little *too* hot.

One thing to know too, is that the Uberschall's clean channels were revoiced in 2003, and also received a gain taper mod on the lead channel.

My recomendation would be to play them for yourself, and to minimally try and find some clips to A/B them. Bogner's website has a bunch of clips that I feel are very accurate. www.bogneramplification.com (http://www.bogneramplification.com/)

For Soldano clips check out BAM member...onemilewish's band site. He uses a Soldano with his PRS. www.onemilewish.com (http://www.onemilewish.com/)

[aleclee]

I own a Soldano Decatone and it's pretty darn versatile--especially considering that all three modes (John P will kick my butt if I call 'em channels :)) share a common EQ. It has surprisingly good cleans, a tasty crunch mode, and that over-the-top overdrive that is Soldano's calling card...all that the push of a footswitch.

The one thing about it that bugs me is that it's very compressed. IMO, that's not an issue on the clean and overdrive modes but it leaves me wanting more on the crunch side of the house. The crunch mode sounds pretty Plexi-like...but it doesn't feel like one. In my experience, it's not a "pant legs flapping in the breeze" kind of amp. Maybe it's just the way I tend to dial things in but that's been my experience.

[barman]

Thanks guys!

[partytrain]

Koch :dude:

[Lance Romance]

None more zealous than the converted. The note definition on the Koch is the best, even when using stupid gain.

[jbird]

I'd wait for the new Mesa Stilletto to come out!;)

[Zach Trowbridge]

I'd wait for the new Mesa Stilletto to come out!;)
I'm curious to hear it too, but I heard that Mesa got such a bad customer reaction to it at NAMM that they've been reworking it ever since to improve it before the ship date. Which, if I recall right, was mid-April, so it should be going out soon...

[Phil Macino]

I'm curious to hear it too, but I heard that Mesa got such a bad customer reaction to it at NAMM that they've been reworking it ever since to improve it before the ship date. Which, if I recall right, was mid-April, so it should be going out soon...
Very interesting. What were the comments saying in general?

[Erik]

Very interesting. What were the comments saying in general?
From what I've heard, the tone was very shrill and ice-pick like. It was supposed to be a upper-mid focused version of the recto line...but somehow fell very short. I'd be very interested in hearing it when it gets reworked. (Not that I heard it first-hand before that.)

Erik H

[Adam]

Are there any users of the Diezel line here? I'm very curious about these, but haven't ever seen one in real life..

Also, what do you folks think of of Randall's new M100 line? The one with the replaceable valve amp modules... I think this is a pretty amazing approach toi modeling. Just loading real tube preamps into the front of the head and channel switching between dual rec, jcm 800, and blackface twin, or whatever.

[Guitarfool]

Are there any users of the Diezel line here? I'm very curious about these, but haven't ever seen one in real life..

Also, what do you folks think of of Randall's new M100 line? The one with the replaceable valve amp modules... I think this is a pretty amazing approach toi modeling. Just loading real tube preamps into the front of the head and channel switching between dual rec, jcm 800, and blackface twin, or whatever.

As opposed to "fake life"? :D ;)


I played the new Randall for about 15 mins, (not long enough) but i thought the sound was a lil "thin".. It didnt seem to really open up + breath like a real tube amp does! --- to be fair it wasnt really cranked up! Great concept with some time + tweaking it might be better...

BTW i used only a couple of the "modules"..

[BrentSP]

Heres some clips of my amps to help you guys out.

Bogner Shiva EL34
Shiva demo (http://www.digitalsoundplanet.com/Members/000133250_000016310.mp3)

Bogner Uberschall
High Gain #1 (http://www.digitalsoundplanet.com/Members/000133250_000015223.mp3)
High Gain #2 (http://www.digitalsoundplanet.com/Members/000133250_000015211.mp3)

Engl Powerball
High Gain #1 (http://www.digitalsoundplanet.com/Members/000102779_000011452.mp3)
High Gain #2 (http://www.digitalsoundplanet.com/Members/000102779_000011122.mp3)

[Erik]

Hey BrentSP, cool clips. You know, I've always dug the way the Powerball sounded, but hearing it straight up against the Uberschall confirms my love of the lower-mid focused amps. That Uber just sounds mean and evil...I loved it. Keep in mind, I'm biased towards the lower-mid focused amps as the owner of a Road King.

[BrentSP]

Hey BrentSP, cool clips. You know, I've always dug the way the Powerball sounded, but hearing it straight up against the Uberschall confirms my love of the lower-mid focused amps. That Uber just sounds mean and evil...I loved it. Keep in mind, I'm biased towards the lower-mid focused amps as the owner of a Road King.
The Powerball is an amazing high gain amp but its very tight and compressed sounding with a hi mid focus. Theres two footswitchable mid controls for Focused Mids and Open Mids. The Uber as you said is mean. Infact its the meanest amp I've ever played. Extremely agressive but unlike the Pball it very open sounding and tight with a BIG low end that is spreaded out in the lower frequencies. While not the highest of hi gainers the Shiva is one of my favorites. It just sounds like the most bad a$$ modded Marshall to date. I use it with a Greenback loaded Bogner 412 for live and its tonal heaven IMO.

[barman]

Which Shiva has the most gain? The 6L6 or the EL34? Does one have more, or are they just different?

[BrentSP]

Which Shiva has the most gain? The 6L6 or the EL34? Does one have more, or are they just different?
No there both the same preamp but you might be able to get more break up sooner with the EL34s.

[barman]

Hey BrentSP, cool clips. You know, I've always dug the way the Powerball sounded, but hearing it straight up against the Uberschall confirms my love of the lower-mid focused amps. That Uber just sounds mean and evil...I loved it. Keep in mind, I'm biased towards the lower-mid focused amps as the owner of a Road King.


How does the Road King rate in this catagory?

[Adam]

In the words of the venerable Strongbad: Holy crap!

I must have a Bogner Shiva. I always regarded these as a great sounding "clean sound" amp, but was unaware of the incredibly lush and sweet high gain they can pump out.

The EL34 Shiva will be the next piece of gear that I buy.

[barman]

In the words of the venerable Strongbad: Holy crap!

I must have a Bogner Shiva. I always regarded these as a great sounding "clean sound" amp, but was unaware of the incredibly lush and sweet high gain they can pump out.

The EL34 Shiva will be the next piece of gear that I buy.
Have you played one. Or just heard the demos?

[Adam]

Have you played one. Or just heard the demos?
No, I haven't played one - and realistically I wouldn't buy one without playing a few of my guitars through it first, but the demos illustrate EXACTLY the tone I've been looking for in a high gain amp. Moreso than any Marshall or Mesa I've played. I've always found marshalls to lack a certain definition, and mesa's can sound pretty buzzy to me. Both companies make great amps, but I need that Shiva tone.

[Erik]

Hey BrentSP, cool clips. You know, I've always dug the way the Powerball sounded, but hearing it straight up against the Uberschall confirms my love of the lower-mid focused amps. That Uber just sounds mean and evil...I loved it. Keep in mind, I'm biased towards the lower-mid focused amps as the owner of a Road King.


How does the Road King rate in this catagory?
Very similar once it is tweaked right. I had mine modded by Voodoo Amps to decompress the gain structure which was my only beef with the Recto line. I now have a gain control that is 100% usable (whereas before nothing past 2:00 sounded good). Interestingly enough, that clip of the Uberschall sounds VERY similar to my Road King, although my amp is a touch brighter.

[Bill McDowell]

Mesa Mark 4

[barman]

Very similar once it is tweaked right. I had mine modded by Voodoo Amps to decompress the gain structure which was my only beef with the Recto line. I now have a gain control that is 100% usable (whereas before nothing past 2:00 sounded good). Interestingly enough, that clip of the Uberschall sounds VERY similar to my Road King, although my amp is a touch brighter.
How are the cleans on the Road King? It seems that in theory it is a very versitile amp. The price for a new RK and Uber are very close. If the RK can get close to the Uber on high gain and have a better clean sound and a Marshall like channel. I may go that rout.

[BrentSP]

How are the cleans on the Road King? It seems that in theory it is a very versitile amp. The price for a new RK and Uber are very close. If the RK can get close to the Uber on high gain and have a better clean sound and a Marshall like channel. I may go that rout.I've own quite a few rectos. Side by side the two lead channels are very different. The Uber is tighter with extremely punchy bass and loads of it. Very even string definition and clarity. Quicker attack and more openess. Overall just a different voicing but both are in the same genre. The clean on the Uber while it will need to be setup unlike most amps is one of the best cleans on a High Gain amp. I would say Rivera has the clean/high gain multi-channel amp thing down the best though. I thought the 3 channel and Road King Recto's clean weren't to shabby either for a High Gain amp.

[rjmmusic]

Wow - that Shiva clip is nice! Now I know why Scott P. raves about the clean so much. Did you have a little flanger or chorus on the clean part?

In the recording, the gainy stuff sounds fairly compressed and dark. Is this just the recording, or is it a characteristic of the amp? Can it be dialed in to have a little more "cut"?

Is the boost function useful?

[BrentSP]

Wow - that Shiva clip is nice! Now I know why Scott P. raves about the clean so much. Did you have a little flanger or chorus on the clean part?

In the recording, the gainy stuff sounds fairly compressed and dark. Is this just the recording, or is it a characteristic of the amp? Can it be dialed in to have a little more "cut"?

Is the boost function useful?I had the treb and presence between 12:00-1:00. I don't find it very compressed at all in fact its quite open sounding to me. I sold my XTC to get this Shiva. The XTC while an outstanding lead amp was very compressed and dark for ryhthm.

[Mr. Black]

I use a VHT 100/cl for high gain, and it sounds absolutely excellent. I dont play like metal or anything like that, but I play some heavy rock sometimes (think tool, apc, and smashing pumpkins) They are a bit pricey, but wll worth it, IMO.
here is my setup:
http://img32.photobucket.com/albums/v95/mancubus/P4040056.jpg

[Anders Destium]

I really like the Engl Powerball in combination with mahogany/maple guitars, it roars and heavy picking gets to the spine immediately :dude: In riff-oriented music it works great.

I almost bought a Koch Powertone, but that was overdoing it a little in my situation :) The clean that it's able to generate is amazing...crystal clear (you don't see that too often with high-gain amps!). The sound is well-rounded, but it seems to miss the brutal punch that the Powerball has.

[BrentSP]

I really like the Engl Powerball in combination with mahogany/maple guitars, it roars and heavy picking gets to the spine immediately :dude: In riff-oriented music it works great.

I almost bought a Koch Powertone, but that was overdoing it a little in my situation :) The clean that it's able to generate is amazing...crystal clear (you don't see that too often with high-gain amps!). The sound is well-rounded, but it seems to miss the brutal punch that the Powerball has.

If you have $4000 the Diezel Herbert is a killer amp to.